rack & pinion steering conversion

mel hubbard · Post by **mel hubbard** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 10:20 am

Im building a vehicle thats currently using a RHD ball joint beam with standard type 1 steering box. I am going to change it to LHD and was thinking about doing a R&P conversion, have loads of room up front so no shortage of mounting points. Any ideas guys?? like off of which model vehicle would be best to use, or maybe there is an aftermarket kit out there. THANKS.

manxdavid · Post by **manxdavid** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 7:26 pm

There was a long article about converting in Manxmania a while ago but the conclusion was that it didn't work out. What year floorpan do you have Mel? I've a drop-arm for a 67 or earlier if you need it.

mel hubbard · Post by **mel hubbard** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:50 pm

[QUOTE="Manxdavid"]There was a long article about converting in Manxmania a while ago but the conclusion was that it didn't work out. What year floorpan do you have Mel? I've a drop-arm for a 67 or earlier if you need it.[/QUOTE] Dave, can you remember what Manxmania that was in?. Its for the VW Jeep,, needs to be LHD,, just thought the rack & pinion would be an easy way as there is a lot of room to mount it,,, got 2 chassis rails to fabricate from so no VW tunnel in the way. Hold on to that drop-arm buddy, if the above proves unsuccessful that will become plan B.

manxdavid · Post by **manxdavid** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 10:24 pm

[QUOTE="mel hubbard"]Dave, can you remember what Manxmania that was in?[/QUOTE] Vol VIII No. 4, the one with Bruce in a fez '80 years old and counting' on the front, about 3 issues ago.

jsturtlebuggy · Post by **jsturtlebuggy** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 10:36 pm

The rack in the article was out of a Rabbit (Golf). Biggest problem with them is to short of tie rods. Large amount of toe change when supension goes up and down. Funco's WampussKitty (1960s and 70s) use a rack and pinion out of an English car. I think it was an Austin Healey?. Quite a few off road racers use a SACO rack. The tie rods almost come together on the bottom of the rack where they bolt on. Longer tie rod means less toe change. Also where you postion rack on front end cause less bump steer. Another rack and pinion that is used is the one out of a Porsche 911,912,and 914. Does have short tie rods. If supension travel is close to stock works well on the street.

mel hubbard · Post by **mel hubbard** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:04 am

Thanks Dave & Joseph, will dig out the old Manx manias and have a read up. A guy local to me builds Healeys,, so that one should be an easy find. On the subject of Austins,, do any of you USA guys remember the Austin America??

the old 3000cc straight six Healey was fine but I would like to apologize on behalf of the Austin (British Motor Company) motor company for this embarrassing excuse of a motor vehicle that we shipped over to you guys back in the 60s

fubar · Post by **fubar** » Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:09 am

I have a center mounted Porche rack on a bus front end. It seems to work ok, it has a hole bunch of positive caster built into it, no bump steer. Would work from either seat but is set up LH drive. The angle and legnth of tye rods is a factor. It is best to sweep the suspension without spring load to check for bump steer before permantly mounting the rack. I rode in a buggy that my friend put a Honda R&P in and it looked good but the tires towed out about 2" at the bottom of the travel....Fortunately we found out in the sand. He cut it out and put a vw box back in. the new style R&P's allow for a lot more rod legnth for longer travel.

mel hubbard · Post by **mel hubbard** » Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:30 pm

[QUOTE="fubar"]I have a center mounted Porche rack on a bus front end. It seems to work ok, it has a hole bunch of positive caster built into it, no bump steer. Would work from either seat but is set up LH drive. The angle and legnth of tye rods is a factor. It is best to sweep the suspension without spring load to check for bump steer before permantly mounting the rack. I rode in a buggy that my friend put a Honda R&P in and it looked good but the tires towed out about 2" at the bottom of the travel....Fortunately we found out in the sand. He cut it out and put a vw box back in. the new style R&P's allow for a lot more rod legnth for longer travel.[/QUOTE] Thanks Fubar,, just read the R&P article in Manx-Mania,, seems Gene Condon sould have asked before cutting that 3'' hole in the frame

That was a whole lotta work for nothing he did

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:26 pm

Mel, You are correct. Gene should have done a little homework before starting out. Like Joseph mentioned, a lot of racers use SACO racks with good success. Here's a couple photos of one that was done correctly. It works extremely well: http://p068.ezboard.com/Fixin-up-a-big- ... =211.topic

mel hubbard · Post by **mel hubbard** » Tue Jun 12, 2007 11:12 pm

[QUOTE="Lee"]Mel, a lot of racers use SACO racks with good success. It works extremely well: http://p068.ezboard.com/Fixin-up-a-big- ... =211.topic[/QUOTE] Lee,that looks just the job :driving: appreciate your help guys :drinking:

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Wed Jun 13, 2007 12:56 am

Mel, Glad I could help shed some light. That's my friend Rob's buggy, "Speedee". He did all the work himself. As I recall, it was quite a job! The SACO rack has a different ratio than the stock steering box. It's a dream off road, but it's a little twitchy on the street because of its sensitivity. This might be compounded by the fact that Speedee has a smaller steering wheel than my buggy. It makes the buggy handle like a race car!

fubar · Post by **fubar** » Wed Jun 13, 2007 6:16 am

I am using the set up my dad used 30+ years ago in Baja. No money to upgrade, but the center link rack has got to be cheaper and better than the Porche rac. I can guarantee that you need a good Koni , Bilstien, etc steering stab if you go + caster...before I got that fixed the car was scary on the street. It had a worn out Koni stab (out of production) and the new Bilstien made a HUGE difference. It went from crazy scary to drive to just hard to shift....

jsturtlebuggy · Post by **jsturtlebuggy** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 7:34 am

There is a reason for Gene mounting the rack like he did it is very difficult to install a rack between the frame head and gas tank on a glass body buggy and it was on a real Manx. So he wrote about his experience. People trying different ideas is how progess is made. Some ideas do not always work the way you wanted them to. SACO racks come in 2 different ratios, 1 to 1 and 1.5 to 1. If you want to slow it down further you can use a HOWE Steering Quickener in reverse. Comes in 2 ratios, 1.5 to 1 or 2 to 1. Has a 3/4" 36 spline shafts. You can find them them is the Summit Racing and Speedway Motors catalogs and others. Where I have seen them mostly used is on stock car racers to change to a faster ratio, but by turning it around it will slow the ratio.