Which is better?

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 7:13 pm

My Uncle and I have recently started a buggy restoration project. We have two different buggys that we are going to combine into one. My question is which front end would be better to use on a street buggy: ball joint or link pin. If anyone has any info I would appreciate it.

mel hubbard · Post by **mel hubbard** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 7:31 pm

[QUOTE="streetbuggy"]My Uncle and I have recently started a buggy restoration project. We have two different buggys that we are going to combine into one. My question is which front end would be better to use on a street buggy: ball joint or link pin. If anyone has any info I would appreciate it.[/QUOTE] I prefer link pin :rock:

CairoManx · Post by **CairoManx** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 7:47 pm

The front ends aren't interchangeable. You'll need to use whichever front end is on the pan you choose to use.

newmanx59 · Post by **newmanx59** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 8:34 pm

I prefer a link-pin front end. It tends to be a little stronger.

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 10:23 pm

Link pin here too!

manxdavid · Post by **manxdavid** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 11:13 pm

Link pin for off-road (but only if fitted with genuine German VW king & linkpins) and ball-joint for street and occasional rough stuff.

allen pierce · Post by **allen pierce** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:07 am

Well, the frame heads ... can be changed out to make the front end what ever you want it to be, but, I'll be the first to admit that it's tricky work to get the new frame head, straight and aligned. And, I'm slightly concerned about how good a welding job you need to do to make it as strong or stronger than original. I'm in the process of shortening a BJ/IRS pan and will either 1) replace the front half (from in front of the VIN forward) with a LP pan, so I can have the IRS rear with the LP front, eventually having a slightly longer travel suspension system (raised spindles and longer trailing arms), with the associated ground clearance for off pavement stuff or 2) finding a "Thing" front beam, as it fits the BJ frame head and will achieve the same effect.

mel hubbard · Post by **mel hubbard** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:40 am

[QUOTE="Manxdavid"]Link pin for off-road (but only if fitted with genuine German VW king & linkpins) and ball-joint for street and occasional rough stuff.[/QUOTE] Now come on Dave which one?? you cant have both

With all the anti speed ramps in the UK, doesn't that qualify for the occasional rough stuff? :rock:

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 4:56 am

Hey there, im glad to see someone mention welding a new pan head on. I was new to buggies a year ago. I bought a basket case (with a newly welded pan head), put it together and had fun all summer driving it. Mine is a 72 super bettle with a link pin front end. The guy welded a new link pin pan head on the chassis. (i guess you can still buy them new?) Anyways i have a pretty good back ground in fabrication and welding. This thing was done when i bought it but it looked pretty easy to put together. It diffenetly didnt take much welding skill to do the job. I to was worried about how stong it was going to be. So in true egotisical fashion i put my own welds over it. Strong as could be and havent had any issues yet. If you do it just have someone that knows how to weld put it on. Its only about 15 minutes of welding once its on. See ya

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 9:00 am

The facts are the ball joint handles much better on the street than a [font=serif]linkpin beam. But like stated beforethe link pin and ball joint beams are not directly interchangeable. There are some fairly easy ways to take care of that through besides putting on a new frame head. My favorite is just tie it into your roll cage and use some handy dandy claps that any VW parts suplier sells. Any ways. something else to think about is what rear end do you want? If you have a buggy with IRS then the front will be a ball joint and I would suggest using that pan. Jsut my thoughts and comments. I know I tend to ramble a bit sometimes.

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 4:05 pm

[QUOTE="dr. awsome"]? If you have a buggy with IRS then the front will be a ball joint and I would suggest using that pan..[/QUOTE] 1967 Bugs had a balljoint front end and a swing rear.

fubar · Post by **fubar** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:06 pm

I have always heard about how much tougher the link pin was supposed to be. They always seem kind of sloppy and clunky to me. What fails on a ball joint that does not fail on the king/link????????????????We used to see how far we could jump a totally stock 66 bug in the vinyards of Napa Valley. I was so impressed with what you could do with that car. Nothing ever broke on it. A little body damage when we slid into a water meter...But loads of fun. we had to charge the batterey and drove with out lights or wipers to save power. Loads of fun for a little money. We called it "The Le Mans Weeble"......

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:32 pm

If I had to choose, I'd say ball joint for a strictly street buggy; link pin for one that sees more off-road duty. My wife's clone is based on a '71 chassis, so hers will have a ball joint front end. My original Manx is based on a shortened '63 chassis, so it is link pin.

Gene-C · Post by **Gene-C** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:34 pm

[QUOTE="WuZaBuG"]1967 Bugs had a balljoint front end and a swing rear.[/QUOTE] So did standard trans-equipped 68's; I have one(only the autostick got IRS in '68).

Lee · Post by **Lee** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:40 pm

"What fails on a ball joint that does not fail on the king/link????????????????" The ball joints. The thing that kills ball joints faster than anything is to let them over extend. They are like CV joints in that regard. They have a limited amount of angular range, and when you try to extend them beyond that range they start to self destruct. The ball joint is at its maximum angle when its shaft makes contact with the housing. Any attempt to extend the ball joint past that angle will result in the shaft distorting the housing, and the ball eventually pulling free from the socket. Link pins do not have this limitation, so you can set them up for more travel with no ill effects. It is important to install some sort of suspension stops when running a ball joint off road. There are no stops on a stock ball joint front end (other than the large rubber snubbers on the shocks, but the suspension can still over extend). I put a "hook and rod" setup on my front end, and I have been over all sorts of paved and dirt roads without any problems. I don't drive it hard in the dirt, as I know that king / link pin front ends can withstand the pounding better than ball joints.